Posted: Sat 29 Dec 2007 01:13 Post subject: Thanks!
Thanks for your answer. I heave now seen your son and your grandchildren in photos in another thread here. Your son looks very handsome and the grandchildren are adorable.
I understand that you are very proud of them.
A happy new year to you and all of you others "OneDropRule" readers out there!!
A Black, Jewish Officer in the Civil War
Contributed by: Phil Downey
Mr. Downey writes:
My great great grandfather Morris Morris was an officer in the Louisiana Native Guard. Morris' mother's maiden name was Carvalho. It is my understanding through oral family history that Morris Morris was Jewish. I have also come to learn that Morris was also part black *I do not know what percentage. Morris migrated to New Orleans with his mother from Jamaica shortly before the war began. I have confirmed through the Jamaican Jewish Genealogy website, that the Carvalho's of Jamaica were Jewish.* I also believe Morris' father was Jewish, thought I have no firm proof on this matter. There is a website dedicated to the Louisiana Native Guard which contains information and photos of Morris Morris. After the war Morris changed his name to Lewis Morrison and went on to become one of the great stage actors of the latter 19th century. I believe he changed his name for two reasons:
1). To escape his African heritage. He was probably considered a Creole in New Orleans. In his photos he has predominantly white features, and:
2). To escape his Jewish heritage. Sadly Jews and Irish Catholics, next to Blacks, were the most despised of White ethnic groups in the late 19th century.
I do not believe that he would have been able to pursue his career in acting had he not changed his identity, FYI, Lewis is the grandfather of Joan and Constance Bennett and the great grandfather of Morton Downey, Jr.
Morris Morris' regiment, "The 1st Louisiana Native Guard," organized as a Confederate Home Guard regiment in June of 1861 and was accepted for service as a Louisiana Militia unit by the Governor of Louisiana shortly thereafter, but was not documented as having seen combat as a Confederate regiment. After the Union occupation of New Orleans in 1861/62, some Black and mulatto officers and enlisted men of the regiment accepted Union service and formed a new USA regiment under the same name. Therefore, although Morris Morris served briefly as a Black Jewish Confederate officer, most of his military service and all of his combat service in the War was as a Union officer. The reorganized "Native Guard" did fight in many battles on behalf of the Union.
At the battle of Port Hudson the 1st Louisiana Native Guard, USA, was the first Black Regiment to fight in combat for the Union.
Historically, Morris Morris is more correctly listed listed as a Union officer.
Shalom,
Phil Downey
Lt. Morris Morris on the "Louisiana Native Guards" website
* Incidents of Travel and Adventure in the Far West by Solomon N. Carvalho can be found on this website. Solomon Carvalho was a native a Barbados, and very probably a relative of Morris Morris.
Sabbath Store
I believe this informative post belongs in the section about whites who discover partial black ancestry:
It is. Many older Portuguese surnames were /is stated to be specifically Jewish but it seems that Sepharad sought to use names that were not well known but with more using the same name(s), it became to be associated with Jews specifically.
Posted: Tue 26 Feb 2008 18:40 Post subject: Jael Strauss myspace
Frechesmaedl wrote:
Apparently, one of the contestants on America's Next Top Model Cycle 8 caused a minor sensation by revealing her heritage saying that her mom is Black and her Dad is a German Jew.
Jael from ANTM Cycle 8 "Half Black/Half German Jew"
Status: In a Relationship
Here for: Networking, Dating, Serious Relationships, Friends
Hometown: Detroit
Body type: 5' 11"
Ethnicity: Other
Religion: Wiccan
Zodiac Sign: Cancer
Children: Proud parent
Occupation: Thug Queen The Horse Stealer
I posted these pics here because I noticed in threads on other boards, there was a bit of a surprise that Slash was half black. And some of the comments I read were from white people. I think some people at first may have assumed he was hispanic, mediterranean, middle-eastern, etc... An "ethic" type. Not only because of his looks, but also his mannerisms, voice, style of dress, hair-style, etc...
That all comes into play too when mentally assigning "race" to others I believe.
And I've personally seen more people who look like him identifying as Latin, Jewish, Arabic, etc... then black.
Personally, I do think he looks biracial/mixed but to be honest I couldn't differentiate him from a host of different ethnic/"racial" groups.
And I don't think I'm alone.
In that pic with his wife, with her being tanned in the photo, I wouldn't be surprised if some people assume they're from the same background.
This "race" thing is funny. Different people honestly see totally different things.
I think the more the general public is made aware of famous black/white biracial people - and the full variety of phenotypes - the more people will start to "see it" and assume that first. Before all of these other designations.
Maybe.
Plus, his eldest son has a stereotypical Latin/Southern Italian look to him IMO.
There are plenty of people who don't look Waspish in the least who identify as (and are identified by others) as white.
I'm still a little confused. Sorry. Are you referring to him as the white child of a black parent or is his son the white child of a black parent?
I agree with what you said about people needing to realize which celebs are halfies. I mean, everybody understands that mulattos/biracials can look like Halle or Barack or Lenny, but do they realize that some of us look like Slash, Jennifer Beals, and Rashida Jones?
No, I can tell you most people don't and that is why I am assumed to be Puerto Rican, Italian, etc.
Since you say you have been confused for being Italian and you are from New Jersey, have you ever had Italians badmouth Black people in your presence because they didn't know they were in the presence of somebody with partial SSA so they thought the coast was clear ?
I'm referring to Slash being considered an ethnic white (not your "all American" type white but certainly non black) to your average Joe Blow who doesn't know his background. And these days, to a considerable amount who do.
I'm sure his mother, probably had some moments of being mistaken as the babysitter/nanny when he was young.
It's sometimes the case when mothers look drastically (at least to others) different than their children.
Personally, I'm not referring to his son. Because to me, "race" is a combination of what you consider yourself to be, how you were raised to identify, and how you're treated by society.
Slash may embrace a purely national identity over a racial one for all I know. He may simply view himself as English and American. And if he's not treated any differently than other English Americans of non mixed ancestry, I would consider his sons generally speaking white if that's how they're being raised to think of themselves and how they're treated by society.
As white as any other predominantly white person of biracial ancestry with a living non white grandparent.
But that's just me.
I think people should have the right to self-identify, and for that identity to be accepted. Of course we all know in the real world this is often not the case. The acceptance by society part.
But people should always be true to themselves in the end. "Society" can say and think what it wants. As long as you have inner peace and security in your own identity, that's the most important thing I think.
Black, White, Biracial, Mulatto/Mulatta, American whatever. As long as a person is at peace with what they personally identify as, I don't see why it should be a problem with anyone else.
Last edited by zsana on Mon 24 Mar 2008 22:09; edited 5 times in total
Since you say you have been confused for being Italian and you are from New Jersey, have you ever had Italians badmouth Black people in your presence because they didn't know they were in the presence of somebody with partial SSA so they thought the coast was clear ?
Nope, but one of my best friend's had an Italian father who badmouthed blacks and she would tell me about it. (Her mom was white.) Someone over at mulatto.org asked me about being around Italians - whether there was any hostility toward blacks. Either the Italians I knew were not like that or they knew me and my sister well enough to know that we were half-black and just kept bigoted comments to themselves.
By the way, my exposure to Italians was extensive. I don't want there to be the impression that maybe I didn't know many Italians. I went to Catholic Elementary School ( K-8 ) in what is essentially the "Little Italy" of Atlantic City, plus three of my mother's brothers married Italian women, and they all treated me and my sister fabulously. Considering that Atlantic City is such a small town, yet I knew at least three different families that had Black/Italian mixed kids (two with Italian moms and one with an Italian dad), I'm guessing that A.C. Italians were not so anti-black, you know?
On the flipside, some of my Puerto Rican friends used to call black people "cocolo" in front of me. At the time, I did not know if it was just a descriptive word (like boriqua for PRs) or a put-down. I learned later that it was most likely a bad word for describing black people.
Last edited by OTHER on Mon 24 Mar 2008 22:12; edited 2 times in total
I'm referring to Slash being considered an ethnic white (meaning accepted as non black) to your average Joe Blow who doesn't know his background. And these days, to a considerable amount who do.
I figured you were referring to his perceived whiteness.
zsana wrote:
I'm sure his mother, probably had some moments of being mistaken as the babysitter/nanny when he was young.
Ouch. I guess my sister and I came out light enough that I don't think anyone ever questioned my white mother as to whose kids we were. Likewise, people probably never batted an eyelash when we were with my dad, since he's quite light and has the same green eyes he gave my big sister.
zsana wrote:
I think people should have the right to self-identify, and for that identity to be accepted. Of course we all know in the real world this is often not the case. The acceptance by society part.
But people should always be true to themselves in the end. "Society" can say and think what it wants. As long as you have inner peace and security in your own identity, that's the most important thing I think.
Black, White, Biracial, Mulatto/Mulatta, American whatever. As long as a person is at peace with what they personally identify as, I don't see why it should be a problem with anyone else.
I completely agree. I think some people don't think about the "at peace" part. If you are mixed and you want to identify as black or white, so be it. More power to ya! But, if you want to identify as black because you believe that black blood overrules all else or if you want to identify as white because you don't like black people then, well, that's not really a good thing, you know?
On the flipside, my Puerto Rican friends used to call black people "cocolo" in front of me. At the time, I did not know if it was just a descriptive word (like boriqua for PRs) or a put-down. I learned later that it was most likely a bad word for describing black people.
I cannot speak to nuiroicans, but in PR it simply designates a dark gringo (a person of mainly African phenotype, but who speaks English, rather than Spanish). The term was coined to denote the many runaways from other islands who found safety in PR when it was the terminus of the Caribean equivalent of the underground railroad. The word may have a derogatory connotation in the 'States. But as far as I know, in PR it is about as derogatory (or not) as "gringo."
On the flipside, my Puerto Rican friends used to call black people "cocolo" in front of me. At the time, I did not know if it was just a descriptive word (like boriqua for PRs) or a put-down. I learned later that it was most likely a bad word for describing black people.
I cannot speak to nuiroicans, but in PR it simply designates a dark gringo (a person of mainly African phenotype, but who speaks English, rather than Spanish). The term was coined to denote the many runaways from other islands who found safety in PR when it was the terminus of the Caribean equivalent of the underground railroad. The word may have a derogatory connotation in the 'States. But as far as I know, in PR it is about as derogatory (or not) as "gringo."
Oh, OK. Good! It didn't seem like they were saying anything akin to the "n" word, but someone later (non-PR) told me it may have had negative connotations. By the way, some of my friends were born in PR and some were born here, but their parents were born in PR. I can't think of any of them having parents born here. So, I'm guessing your definition was there's, as well.
Perceived whiteness. Yes! You broke it down nicely OTHER. That's what I was getting at. You figured correctly.
I really identify a lot with what you described growing up. It's almost a carbon copy of my situation.
My husband never gets second looks when he's out with our sons. They have his blue eyes and look like light beige brunette versions of him. What's great is I've never had that nanny question. People certainly notice when I'm and about with them, because it's obvious I'm considered a light-skinned black woman (brown-skinned) and have relaxed hair, and their not black in appearance. But there's never any uncomfortableness or awkward moments. At least not with white people.
Yeah, that "at peace" part can be a difficult place to achieve for some people.
Even though Slash is of partial SSA ancestry, if he had married a woman with a strong SSA phenotype like this woman for example
In my country it would be considered by most to be an interracial union. I personally know a Brazilian couple where one partner has invisible Blackness but genetically has a drop of SSA ancestry in their family tree judging by his family photo album while his girlfriend has crystal clear SSA features, yet they still openly consider themselves to be an interracial couple even though both have Black blood but the more European looking of the 2 does not self identify as Black.
Yeah most likely, if in the U.S where the definition of what looks Black is more loose and yet that still doesnt stop many Americans from constantly confusing you for being Nonblack, than in Brazil you would definitely for sure be seen by most Brazilians as being racially different from your husband. Didn't you say once that you and your husband have been confused for an interracial couple before, judging by the ugly stares that you would get from some Black women ?
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But, how come this is posted in the Black Parents with White Kids thread? 
